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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><!-- Converted from text/plain format -->OK,
the data model project has been approved and is now online at:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="https://sourceforge.net/projects/envirodata/">http://sourceforge.net/projects/envirodata/</a></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>People interested in developing on this
can send me an email off list, rwburgholzer [at] deq [dot] virginia [dot] gov
with their sourceforge user names, and I will add you to the developers list,
and we can start getting to the business of defining the tasks and breaking
them into logical chunks.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>r.b.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Robert W. Burgholzer</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Surface Water Modeler</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Office of Water Supply and Planning</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Virginia Department of Environmental
Quality</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="mailto:rwburgholzer@deq.virginia.gov">rwburgholzer@deq.virginia.gov</a></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>804-698-4405</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Open Source Modeling Tools:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="http://sourceforge.net/projects/npsource/">http://sourceforge.net/projects/npsource/</a></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net
[mailto:postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b></span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Burgholzer,Robert</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, January 22, 2008
3:17 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>PostGIS Users
Discussion</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [postgis-users]
Pipeline Data Model</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Just as an update, I have
submitted a project for sourceforge hosting approval, called
“Environmental Data Models”, short name “envirodata”.
</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Perhaps the
“envirodata” moniker is too restrictive, maybe, ogcdata would be
better. Since I didn’t get any feedback, I just called it something that
I thought was relevant. Any suggestions would be welcome.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I will mail more when I
get approval.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>r.b.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Robert W. Burgholzer</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Surface Water Modeler</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Office of Water Supply
and Planning</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Virginia Department of
Environmental Quality</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="mailto:rwburgholzer@deq.virginia.gov">rwburgholzer@deq.virginia.gov</a></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>804-698-4405</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Open Source Modeling
Tools:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="http://sourceforge.net/projects/npsource/">http://sourceforge.net/projects/npsource/</a></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net
[mailto:postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Burgholzer,Robert<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, January 14, 2008
12:26 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> PostGIS Users Discussion; PostGIS
Users Discussion<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [postgis-users]
Pipeline Data Model</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p style='margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:1.0in'><font
size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>OK,<br>
I will begin the process of starting a sourceforge project to house the data
models and supporting SQL functions, etc. It would be great if Abe can facilitate
some space for some of this as well, I think that the sourceforge is a good way
to go about managing contributions and so forth, but if geoloaded.com could
host some demos/case-studies, that would be really great (if that is what you
have in mind).<br>
<br>
What would we be trying to do, putting together/porting some data models for
this kind of pipeline/hydro data? What would it be called, i.e., what would one
call a generic class of data models that would encapsulate that which we are
working on?<br>
<br>
r.b.<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net on behalf of
Abram Gillespie<br>
Sent: Mon 1/14/2008 11:35 AM<br>
To: PostGIS Users Discussion<br>
Cc: <br>
Subject: Re: [postgis-users] Pipeline
Data Model<br>
<br>
All,<br>
<br>
These are all very interesting ideas. I have a proposal - I've been<br>
meaning to get a site running at geoloaded.com (nothing there ATM),<br>
and though sharing data models isn't *specifically* the idea I had in<br>
mind, it's very much in the spirit of what I intend to do. I'm happy<br>
to host anything the group manages to put together. I'm not clear on<br>
the EULA of the data model I currently have in my possession, but if I<br>
can, I will post my results at the site as soon as I have something.<br>
<br>
R.B.,<br>
<br>
I'm swamped right now but will be in touch as soon as I have a moment.<br>
I live at 14th & Main BTW. Small world indeed.<br>
<br>
-Abe<br>
<br>
On </span></font><font size=2><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Jan 14, 2008</span></font><font
size=2><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> 7:47 AM, Burgholzer,Robert<br>
<rwburgholzer@deq.virginia.gov> wrote:<br>
> We might think to do a little divide and conquer strategy on the database
that Abe has, perhaps recruiting a group of individuals to each sign up for a
handful of tables to convert to postgres, and then upload them all to a
sourceforge repository.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> r.b.<br>
><br>
><br>
> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: postgis-users-bounces@postgis.refractions.net on behalf
of Chris Hermansen<br>
> Sent: Sun 1/13/2008 </span></font><font
size=2><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>12:47 PM</span></font><font size=2><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
> To: PostGIS Users Discussion<br>
> Cc:<br>
> Subject: Re: [postgis-users]
Pipeline Data Model<br>
><br>
><br>
> Gustavo makes a great point here.<br>
><br>
> Having worked with workstation ArcInfo for many years, I have a kind of<br>
> "conceptual library" of how to do common tasks in the field in
which I work.<br>
><br>
> As I use PostGIS I have to re-learn this "conceptual library",
based on<br>
> the building blocks defined by OGC. I have to say that my general<br>
> impression is that the OGC geoprocessing model sometimes necessitates<br>
> some pretty complicated SQL to achieve what is relatively<br>
> straightforward in workstation ArcInfo, an example being given in the<br>
> Wiki on geometrically combining partially overlapping polygon geometries<br>
> so as not to generate null geometries where only one or the other input<br>
> geometry exists.<br>
><br>
> In our company, we are (slowly) working on some documentation that<br>
> demonstrates how to accomplish "model tasks" in PostGIS.<br>
><br>
> One of the biggest challenges we face (and would face on platforms other<br>
> than PostGIS as well) is cleaning up the cruft coming in from all the<br>
> nasty shapefiles floating around out there. For example,<br>
> self-overlapping polygon geometry, gaps between polygons that aren't<br>
> supposed to be there, tiny noise components arising from unfiltered<br>
> GPS-source data. I could go on :-)<br>
><br>
> Another area of challenges is where we want a different geometric<br>
> outcome than provided for in the OGC standard. A simple example is<br>
> first being surprised by, then dealing with, degenerate geometries or<br>
> composite geometries generated by what seem to be fairly straightforward<br>
> geometric operations. A more complex example is the example given
above<br>
> - most of the time, when we overlay partially overlapping geometries, we<br>
> don't want null geometries as a result in locations where only one or<br>
> the other input geometry exists, rather we want whatever geometry exists<br>
> with the appropriate attributes set to null.<br>
><br>
> Another is creating new geometries from components - geometries from<br>
> text files, polygons from lines and points, etc.<br>
><br>
> Two things I see discussed on this list that could be of interest in the<br>
> future are topology and time travel. Way back when PostgreSQL was
just<br>
> Postgres I did some work with time travel; I can see real potential in<br>
> the concept, for example as a framework for managing and reporting on<br>
> environmental certification. However that's a big design issue even<br>
> with time travel working :-) With respect to topology, I'm surprised<br>
> how little I miss it; though there are people in our offices who find<br>
> it's the only solution for fixing up really nasty shape files; ie<br>
> convert the data to coverages and bang away at them using the polygon<br>
> topology until either nothing is left or the problem is fixed.<br>
><br>
> Anyway. Whether the approach to sharing this kind of info is through<br>
> separate projects or just a bit more input to the PostGIS wiki, it seems<br>
> pretty worthwhile to me.<br>
><br>
> Gustavo Ces wrote:<br>
> > You canīt export a geodatabase ( i supose your model is just that) by<br>
> > odbc, because the geometric logic is not transfered ( can you export
a<br>
> > geodatabase in arcgis to postgis?) I think you have to rewrite the<br>
> > model, adapting it to postgis. Is a hard work, but the you can use
the<br>
> > postgresql full potential ( triggers, views, etc.. ) to make your<br>
> > model more powerfull, smaller and dynamic.<br>
> > In my experience, this work simplifies the model, and you can make it<br>
> > "real-time", user adapted, etc...<br>
> ><br>
> > Iīve posted a long time ago a question about postgis models. I
imagine<br>
> > all postgis community members working alone, creating complex<br>
> > functions and schemas to solve their problems and... reinventing the<br>
> > wheel. Perhaps itīs time to create especific projects to create ( or<br>
> > traduce ) schemas and functions for various cases. I know the wiki,<br>
> > but i think in environmental members creating schemas,
functions to<br>
> > solve environmental questions( for instance). At this time each of<br>
> > them has to walk his way alone ...<br>
> ><br>
> > Itīs just an opinion :)<br>
> ><br>
> > Gus<br>
> ><br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > postgis-users mailing list<br>
> > postgis-users@postgis.refractions.net<br>
> > <a
href="http://postgis.refractions.net/mailman/listinfo/postgis-users">http://postgis.refractions.net/mailman/listinfo/postgis-users</a><br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Regards,<br>
><br>
> Chris Hermansen · <a href="mailto:clh@timberline.ca">mailto:clh@timberline.ca</a><br>
> tel:+1.604.714.2878 · fax:+1.604.733.0631<br>
> Timberline Natural Resource Group · <a href="http://www.timberline.ca">http://www.timberline.ca</a><br>
> 401 · 958 West 8th Avenue · Vancouver BC · Canada · V5Z 1E5<br>
><br>
> C'est ma faįon de parler.<br>
><br>
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><br>
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